From the moment I first heard The Beastie Boys's "Fight For Your Right To Party," I figured they were swiping the MC5's "Kick Out The Jams" guitar riff. Not just the three-chord riff, but the song structure, too, to some extant. Yet, no one else seems to have noticed this, at least when I did an internet search. Am I hearing things?

(I also assumed that Afrika Bambatta's pretty much straight-ahead remake of "Kick Out The Jams" was done as a rock-meets-hiphop response to the Beasties.)

I have never heard "Kick Out The Jams," actually. It's another one of those songs where it's talked about rather than played.

Former TP subscriber [81, 82, 83, 84]

[postpunkmonk.com]
For further rumination on the Fresh New Sound of Yesterday®

Monk, me neither!

Well, you've never claimed to be the Proto-Punk Monk, so it's all good.

I'd never really noticed a similarity between "Fight For Your Right" and "Kick Out the Jams" until Fab pointed out. I hear it now, but don't think it's so pronounced that I'll never think of one without the other again or anything. Hell, I say throw in "Smoke On the Water" and you'll have three sibling songs that look enough alike to be family but no one will mistake them for triplets.

I would agree the song has that same sense of decadence and a repeating chord structure. But I would not say it is a swipe. It is funny you bring them up, it is amazing how often they get shout outs in rock documentaries. You know the ones where they find everybody in the brother to talk about "the scene" around the band "insert". Flea shows up all of the time, hell even Patten Oswalt! But if you want to watch the doc you have to put up with it. The new thing is to add weird animations in the strangest places. People kept mentioning them when I realized a few years ago - I had never purposely listened to or own anything by the MC5! Quite frankly I still have not, other than Kick out the Jams showed up in my Tidal My Daily Discovery playlist and then I added it, it is a nice tune. I had listened to some White Stripes recently and it threw in the MC5 a few days later. It is a really nice feature that gives you 10 (usually, sometimes more) tunes to listen to that are related in some way to your recent Tidal listening habits, it updates daily. (duh!) So if you are like me and your listening tastes are literally all over the map your suggested 10 songs are going to be fairly interesting.

I looked it up - both songs use the same kind of chord progression (I-III-IV, i think?), tho in a different key.

I'm surprised by the lack of MC5 fans here, I figured if the TP forum isn't full of MC5 heads, what is? Guess that explains why they're nominated, but usually towards the bottom of the RRHoF votes.

I plan on checking the MC5's out more fully this weekend. Speaking of Detroit, my friend turned me on to a documentary about the band called Death. I had never heard of them, I need to check their stuff out as well. The doc was pretty good and the music sounded ok.

After that documentary came out, Death's debut album was rereleased and the band reformed (minus David Hackney who had died in the interim), put out a new album and toured a few times. I saw them once and it was a joyful experience. Instead of being bitter about being passed over for so many years, the band seemed genuinely thrilled to be playing in front large crowds. I think some of the audience was expecting a more 'punk' show and was puzzled by the lack of aggression. At least no one was complaining that they were the wrong Death. Their post-discovery album is kinda of dull, I would stick to "For All the World to See"

Members of this forum sure were enthusiastic for the "MC50" tour three years ago. I had a great time seeing that show ... but as for the 5's music, on any kind of regular basis? Their best-of on Rhino seems to satisfy me just fine.

I'm a big MC5 fan and think "KOTJ" is one of the greatest, if not THE greatest, rock & roll songs ever created. I also think Rob Tyner is the leather-lunged vocalist all similar rock vocalists fall short in comparison to.

The album from which it comes, however, not so much. It was recorded live, as we all know, but very poorly, with really muddy sound. Plus I don't think the band's songwriting mojo was in full effect yet. They didn't really hit their stride until Back in the USA, which was seen as a commercial compromise at the time, but now seems prescient as far as punk and power pop go. I'd argue their masterpiece is their final album High Time, which rolls everything into one big ball of transcendent rock & roll.

That said, Delvin isn't wrong - I could quibble with the song selection, but the Rhino best-of is one of those comps that serves as a truly great introduction to a band's work.

I saw both the MC50 tour and the DTK MC5 tour (which included all three then-surviving members, plus Marshall Crenshaw, Mark Arm and Evan Dando, who was badly miscast, but at least had the right enthusiasm). Both great shows I'll never forget. I've seen Wayne Kramer's solo band several times as well, and he's never disappointed.

As for the main thrust of this thread, I agree with Upper90's assessment. Similar chord structure and theme, but different keys, rhythm and attitude (which is everything). I've always thought "Fight For Your Right" had more in common with AC/DC than the 5. But, as Nightdrive points out, it's all variations on the same three chords anyway.

As for Death, I also agree with the assessments here - stick with For All the World to See. (I think the notion that it's a seminal proto-punk album is WAY overstated, so if you go into it with that mindset, you'll be disappointed. But it's still a worthwhile rock record, especially for Detroit rock fanatics.) I saw Death at Fun Fun Fun Fest several years ago, during the year of their revival, and I think I found out later that it was only their third or fourth show since reuniting. It started out very tentative, but by the end they were firing on all cylinders.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2021 03:35AM by Michael Toland.

That’s how rock works. Take a little, add a little. I’m not a huge BBS fan but they make that song so original that the antecedents are nothing more that intellectual.
Most guitarists will tell you, there’s nothing new in the rock world. It’s all variations.

Oh, I agree with Mr Toland… always heard the fun, dumb riff in the Beasties track to be pure AC/DC … and that’s a compliment to both acts.

MC5 are just one of those bands that I have albums by, have had their significance beaten into my head, and mean to get around to listening to them more often … but rarely do.

It’s no knock on them. Truth be told I rarely get around to listening to the classic Kinks albums of the mid-60s on Reprise records, though I know I should.

They were just a little too ahead of my prime listening era… and sometimes feeling like you HAVE to go back and listen to something feels like work.

(but that said, this conversation will probably get me to pull out my MC5 albums again!)

Rick Rubin has said that his production on Def Jam's early releases was inspired by the stripped-down sound of AC/DC. LICENSED TO ILL kicks off with a song that lays the guitar riff to "Sweet Leaf" over the drums from "When the Levee Breaks," and its production seems much more grounded in mainstream hard rock than the MC5.

Speaking of whom, I'm surprised no one has brought up the ROIR release. Although it consists of alternate takes and uncollected tracks, it served as a greatest hits album before an official one existed. HIGH TIME is my favorite album of theirs - BACK IN THE U.S.A. might have been great if the production didn't flatten out the band's power - and I wonder how they would've developed if they recorded several more and expanded on its direction.

If you're catching up on the 5, you need to listen to ALL three albums. Each one has something different to offer.