Don or Frank? [URL=http://www.yourfreepoll.com/mygorqlasp.html][IMG]http://www.yourfreepoll.com/votebutton.gif[/IMG][/URL] https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37651#msg-37651 Sat, 06 Jun 2026 23:57:57 -0500 Phorum 5.2.23 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,38702#msg-38702 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,38702#msg-38702
but on this topic and that quote, he was just plain wrong.

my humble opinion...

]]> dkhazzam Trouser Press Mon, 13 Feb 2012 21:30:44 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,38692#msg-38692 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,38692#msg-38692 Doc this weekend, and listened to it this morning. You know, I think I finally get it. It doesn't sound nearly as radical to me now as it did back in the late 80s/early 90s when I first listened to it, but it still sounds unique. Now I need to get Crow.]]> Michael Toland Trouser Press Mon, 13 Feb 2012 14:17:50 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37750#msg-37750 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37750#msg-37750
Really? My high school had a creepy custodian with the exact same whiskers. Come to think of it, that may have turned me off to Zappa, back in those days.]]> Delvin Trouser Press Fri, 09 Dec 2011 21:41:40 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37741#msg-37741 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37741#msg-37741 hoip chiggs Trouser Press Fri, 09 Dec 2011 09:17:34 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37733#msg-37733 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37733#msg-37733 Valley Girl soundtrack. And Nicholas Cage, who got his big break starring in the movie.]]> breno Trouser Press Thu, 08 Dec 2011 18:38:09 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37732#msg-37732 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37732#msg-37732
Quote

>>Just as an exercise ... would anyone care to list a few
>>"Zappa-influenced" artistes?
> Any bar band that's ever played "Smoke on the Water."

Man, that's oblique.

]]> Nile Trouser Press Thu, 08 Dec 2011 18:23:05 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37731#msg-37731 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37731#msg-37731
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Just as an exercise ... would anyone care to list a few "Zappa-influenced" artistes?

Any bar band that's ever played "Smoke on the Water."]]> breno Trouser Press Thu, 08 Dec 2011 17:56:58 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37730#msg-37730 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37730#msg-37730 > Just as an exercise ... would anyone care to list a few "Zappa-influenced" artistes? Does Mr. Bungle fall into this category?

Steve Vai
Warren Cuccurrulo
George Duke
Chad Wackerman
Adrian Belew
Terry Bozzio
Jean Luc Ponty
Mike Kenneally
Dweezil Zappa (duh)

I don't care what anyone says. Zappa was an AMAZING musician. I don't go for a lot of the low-brow humor stuff, but that was just a fraction of his recorded output. His music was so diverse that if you don't dig Joe's Garage, you just move on to Hot Rats which is in another universe entirely.]]> zoo Trouser Press Thu, 08 Dec 2011 17:44:25 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37715#msg-37715 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37715#msg-37715 Shiny makes me rank it lower, c/w the availability of the boot. We'll see - if/when g.Zappa gets the new release out.

edit::I wish I had an idea what these words mean:
8-track of Shiny Beast and took a flyer on it
On second thought I'll just appreciate the nice poetry of it. I'll put that in my lyrics fragments file, TYVM. In the meantime can you haiku it up?



Post Edited (12-08-11 00:38)]]> Paganizer Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 16:54:35 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37714#msg-37714 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37714#msg-37714
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I rank thusly:
Doc
Ice Cream
Milk
Decals

I'd put Shiny Beast at number two on that list, but otherwise agree with the rankings. And I may just be overly fond of Shiny Beast because it was my introduction to the Captain. I'd heard his name many times, but never actually heard him until I was a senior in high school and a friend found a 99 cent 8-track of Shiny Beast and took a flyer on it, and we then spent the next two weeks driving around singing "Floppy Boot Stomp," "Tropical Hot Dog Night" and "When I See Mommy I Feel Like a Mummy" nonstop.]]> breno Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 16:18:08 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37712#msg-37712 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37712#msg-37712
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i googled frank zappa n lou reed together and i am reading about everything posted for hours.
so many differences in opinions and so many things that are contradictory.
And yet Lou inducted Zappa into the R&R HoF. I actually did a web search last year trying to figure out how the hell that happened, and couldnt' come up with anything. Frank had no surviving friends?

Quote

Can you imagine pulling up at a stop light with the windows rolled down and looking over into the next car to see some freaks singing along to "Neon Meate Dream Of An Octafish?"
When I give my daughter a bath and she plays with her toy octopus, I've been known to "sing" that very song in my imitation Beefheartian growl. But she's a toddler, she's not scared. Yet.

Quote

I would never hate on Frank, though. He didn't just report to congress, he stood up to the man
+1]]> MrFab Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 16:17:19 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37711#msg-37711 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37711#msg-37711 He didn't just report to congress, he stood up to the man in a way loaded with a meaning that's easily forgotten due to changing times. The man that really was The Man. It wouldn't mean as much today but that's only, in part, because he did so. Today musicians can be linked to politics without culture-shock reckoning. Frank went to bat.]]> Paganizer Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 16:04:18 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37710#msg-37710 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37710#msg-37710 -------------------------------------
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I need to go back and revisit those, especially the last two.
Agreed, fwiw. Start there.
The style he was going after on TMR peaked on the more listenable Lick My Decals but it's TMR that has received the patina-badge of "Classic". The timing, the cover art, the fact it charted in the UK and the Foghat* syndrome.

I rank thusly:
Doc
Ice Cream
Milk
Decals

I used to listen to Frank some but more as a curiosity. Was familiar with 5 or 6 titles. I knew guys in college who ate it up. I think Frank's demographic comment had as much to do with the peak age of record-buying regardless. I can't fully remember exactly why it turned me off but there was a Dead boot where Frank tells 10,000 tripping, grinning, happy concert-goers, "Now I'm going to fuck with you". It fit the descriptions given above re smugness and unapproachability. He wasn't invited back.


*(Double w/gatefold)

]]> Paganizer Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 16:00:04 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37705#msg-37705 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37705#msg-37705
It was about 10 years apart. My tastes had broadened and evolved a lot since the first time I gave it a shot. I thought I might appreciate it more the second time around, especially since I'd acquired an appreciation of free jazz by that time, and I've always kinda thought (rightly or wrongly) that TMR was the Captain treating the blues as free jazz.

I've listened to a few other Beefheart records, which I acquired after the first go-'round with TMR - Shiny Beast, Doc at the Radar Station, Ice Cream For Crow. I need to go back and revisit those, especially the last two.]]> Michael Toland Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 12:46:04 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37703#msg-37703 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37703#msg-37703
> So are older Zappa fans like older "Star Wars" geeks, video gamers, and the like? Those people who go to sci-fi conventions in costumes?

Seems an apt comparison to me.

Quote2:
> Just as an exercise ... would anyone care to list a few "Zappa-influenced" artistes? Does Mr. Bungle fall into this category?

A couple of the later Godley-Creme albums are pretty Zappa soaked. They even namecheck him ("I was getting into Zappa while you were getting into Zen")]]> R. Totale Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 12:29:35 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37695#msg-37695 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37695#msg-37695
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I've tried Captain Beefheart numerous times - bought Trout Mask Replica twice over the years - and while I can appreciate what he's doing and why he's important, it's not music I've ever listened to for pleasure.

Trout Mask Replica ... twice? Why twice? I mean, was it that bad the first time 'round? If the stove top is hot, why go back?

That' seems like a bad place to start with the good Captain. I'd start people at the beginning with Safe As Milk and caution them that it's only gonna get weirder. Safe As Milk has actual songs. Songs you could sing during your morning commute.

...

Can you imagine pulling up at a stop light with the windows rolled down and looking over into the next car to see some freaks singing along to "Neon Meate Dream Of An Octafish?"


"Squirmin' serum 'n semen 'n syrup 'n semen 'n serum!"

...
...

Quote

Ironically, though, when it comes to music influenced by either artist, I tend to listen to the Beefheart followers instead of the Zappa ones.

Just as an exercise ... would anyone care to list a few "Zappa-influenced" artistes? Does Mr. Bungle fall into this category?]]> HollowbodyKay Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 03:03:38 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37693#msg-37693 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37693#msg-37693 so many differences in opinions and so many things that are contradictory.]]> rebelwithoutaclue Trouser Press Wed, 07 Dec 2011 02:11:03 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37690#msg-37690 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37690#msg-37690 Delvin Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 20:23:21 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37684#msg-37684 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37684#msg-37684
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I'm also willing to believe that those who remain passionate Zappa fans into their late 20s and onward are simply intellectually or aesthetically stunted.

That's pretty interesting. So are older Zappa fans like older "Star Wars" geeks, video gamers, and the like? Those people who go to sci-fi conventions in costumes? Of course, it may be totally unfair to call those types "intellectually or aesthetically stunted" - I just say that because, like Zappa, I don't "get" that whole scene.



Post Edited (12-06-11 12:38)]]> MrFab Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 14:19:56 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37683#msg-37683 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37683#msg-37683
I'm not Jewish, but otherwise I was square in his demographic when I was a Zappa fan, and I was a big one. When I grew out of it, my fanhood diminished. I'm perfectly willing to believe that his later work, which doesn't move me from what I've heard of it, is just as good as anything he did that I liked earlier - it's just no longer for me. I'm also willing to believe that those who remain passionate Zappa fans into their late 20s and onward are simply intellectually or aesthetically stunted. He didn't care, so why should I?]]> R. Totale Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 12:44:11 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37681#msg-37681 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37681#msg-37681 lou reed was a pretensious asshole without a great sense of humour.

like em both though]]> rebelwithoutaclue Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 11:43:17 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37680#msg-37680 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37680#msg-37680 Trout Mask Replica twice over the years - and while I can appreciate what he's doing and why he's important, it's not music I've ever listened to for pleasure.

I used to own several Zappa records, but, again, I always appreciated them more than I enjoyed them. Hot Rats is the only record I ever listened to more than a couple of times.

Ironically, though, when it comes to music influenced by either artist, I tend to listen to the Beefheart followers instead of the Zappa ones.]]> Michael Toland Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 11:32:51 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37679#msg-37679 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37679#msg-37679 erikalbany Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 10:23:14 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37677#msg-37677 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37677#msg-37677 The Guinness Book of Poisonous Quotations:

Quote

"Frank Zappa is probably the single most untalented person I've ever heard in my life. He's two-bit, pretentious, academic, and he can't play his way out of anything. He can't play rock 'n' roll because he's a loser. And that's why he dresses so funny. He's not happy with himself, and I think he's right."[/i] - Lou Reed

I voted for Beefheart ... by a blue million miles. Zappa's stuff was never my trough of swill. It's like watching someone dissect a lab rat.]]> HollowbodyKay Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 08:24:51 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37675#msg-37675 Re: Don, Frank, or Mark? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37675#msg-37675
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How is that Fall album
I thought I already reviewed it somewhere on this board but I don't see that post...

...It got bett-ah.
Most new Fall albums wear their face in public; this revealed its visage slower - probably because it's rather dense, in fact, mostly a hard rock outing (liner note from MES, "Brightness does not fit with an ersatz GB"). Rather than setting it aside for others in my to-listen pile it has stayed in rotation, so that says something. It will likely be in at least one category on my year-end list (though at this point that means it will chuck out another title). It's interesting to note that he has now kept the band for three albums (though I believe he's currently touring some of the American guys again).

The last 5 {LP} and how I would rank them/suggest purchases:
Fall Heads Roll [2005]
Imperial Wax Solvent [2008]
Ersatz GB [2011]
Your Future, Our Clutter [2010]
Reformation, Post TLC [2007]

edit:: and surely you're aware of the saying that an average Fall album is still better than fishing at work (or summat)?

NP::
Damned - Grave Disorder
Stones - Some Girls Deluxe
Trash Talk - Awake
Janes Addiction - Escape Artist



Post Edited (12-05-11 23:43)]]> Paganizer Trouser Press Tue, 06 Dec 2011 01:14:15 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37669#msg-37669 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37669#msg-37669
How is that Fall album, Pagan?]]> rhettlawrence Trouser Press Mon, 05 Dec 2011 20:28:12 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37666#msg-37666 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37666#msg-37666
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The Captain's music, to me, is fun. Even at its most challenging, I hear a sense of amusement within it all. Zappa, even at his best, always seems to have a smug, above-it-all quality that I never hear in Beefheart. To me, Zappa always seemed to think he was better than his own audience.

Bingo. Which is why I find it a bit curious that they're always yoked together (apart from the obvious historical connections). The Cap'n seems more intuitive and soulful, and thus a more natural punk progenitor then Zappa's academic exercises and humorless humor.

"Zappa was important to me as an example of everything I didn't want to do. I'm very grateful to him, actually."
- Brian Eno]]> MrFab Trouser Press Mon, 05 Dec 2011 14:22:19 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37664#msg-37664 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37664#msg-37664
]]> Delvin Trouser Press Mon, 05 Dec 2011 02:53:30 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37663#msg-37663 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37663#msg-37663 erikalbany Trouser Press Mon, 05 Dec 2011 00:19:47 -0600 https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37659#msg-37659 Re: Don or Frank? https://trouserpress.com/forum/read.php?1,37651,37659#msg-37659
Beefheart I like, but he's no Zappa.



Post Edited (12-04-11 22:39)]]> zoo Trouser Press Sun, 04 Dec 2011 21:38:22 -0600